Subdivisions on double click

[Oaktown]

I would love to have the ability to add an X or Y subdivision in the Output Transformation>Edit Point>Warping option by double clicking (same as the bezier points for masks) so that I can add one or two X or Y subdivision wherever I want rather than have to subdivide by a larger number to get subdivision where I want.

In a ideal world, I'd be able to choose the position of the subdivision by double clicking on the horizontal (X subdivision) or vertical (Y subdivision) outline or by choosing the exact location in X or Y coordinate.

This would allow to easily move a long line evenly rather than have to move each point a different number of pixels because the line is cut into subsegments.

[Joris]

I know what you mean, but I think you may be disappointed in how this actually would work.

Warping always requires the texture to be subdivided in triangles or squares ( which are two triangles put together ).

Let's say we place an arbitrary single point by double clicking in the location of the white dot. This would require the texture to be subdivided in triangles, indicated by the yellow lines. You can imagine that when you then warp this point, the geometry will warp very awkwardly along the subdivision lines. You can recreate this behaviour and see how it will warp by creating four triangle polyslices and warping their corner points.

Another option would be to subdivide it into four squares, indicated by the red dotted line. Essentially what we're doing then, is creating another additional four warper points, that have undefined behaviour. Should they move constrained on their axes along with the white dot? Should they stay in place and create warped angles when moving the white dot? You can also check the different result of each behaviour by creating four regular slices and warping the corner points.

All in all, warping video will always be glorified smudging. You're transforming the shape of pixels to some other shape. So something always has to give, ie something's always going to come out somehow wrong. The only way that you can evenly warp an image with even distortion, is by having four points in perspective. Anything after that becomes pixel smudging.

[Joris]

Screenshots of how the three different ways woud look. If you look at the center circle, I don't think either one of them really comes out right.

Triangulated

Square with points fixed

Square with points constrained along axes

[Oaktown]

Hey Joris, thanks for your detailed reply. The main thing I'm after is being able to subdivide without being forced to do it many times to get a subdivision that's close to what I want.

Here are a few pictures to illustrate:

Ideally, I'd want to be able to define where my subdivision are to the pixel.

[Zoltán]

you could do that with 3 slices or not?

edit: snapping for warping points to other slice's warping points would help a lot with this.

[Oaktown]

That's an option but it gets complicated when you have to manage all these point in multiple slices.

The main idea is that I want to be able to adjust one irregular section (for instance the small vertical section on the right) and still get that straight diagonal with minimal programming so being able to subdivide the space to my own specs would make the job much much easier.

[Joris]

So can you give a screenshot of a setup where using multiple slices would be too much of a pain in the ass, and how the warping would need to look?

That would help a lot with figuring which of the 3 subdivision methods we should look further into.

[elgarf]

As I saw in another soft, there is often used triangulated or square with fixed point methods. Now resolume uses second method, doesn't it?
If there will be ability to put points in any place of slice, can that points be bezier?

[Oaktown]

@Joris: Rather than fabricating a mockup, here is a quick demo in Mapio of what I'd like to be able to achieve in the Arena Advance Output:

phpBB [video]

Then to answer the question re. multiple slices vs the ability to custom subdivide a slice here are my thoughts:
1) Multiple slices to manage this kind of work forces one to make lengthy calculations when input and output are not perfectly matched in size.
2) Wherever a mapping point is in two slices, now instead of moving one point you have to move two points.
3) You can't move points in multiple slices at the same time

[Joris]

Picture's worth a thousand words. Thanks.

Ivan really does some slick stuff on Mapio. Props.